Collett, Maxwell Amner (Max) Interview

Today is the 4 November 2015. I’m interviewing Max Collett, retired Accountant, also about his wartime exploits and Spitfire Fighters etc, and the life and times of himself and his family. Max could you tell me something about where your family came from initially.

They came from Stroud in Gloucestershire. The New Zealand members of the family arrived in 1840 after a four month trip in a ship. They landed at Wellington and they settled in Petone. They were mainly engineers, the men, and they opened up a big factory at Dannevirke and my grandfather opened up a blacksmith’s shop in Waipawa. My father was a keen military man. He was a lieutenant in the Boer War. He was a Captain in the Great War. He was badly injured at Passchendaele, and gassed at Passchendaele and when he came home he never worked again because of his accidents and trouble with the war.

Max, when they came out to New Zealand on the boat, were the children born then or were they born later on?

Some of them were born then and some were born in New Zealand.

Yes, so some of them survived the journey out here?

Oh yes.

And they would have gone to school in Petone? Yes – before they eventually came out and …

Petone yes. That’s right, and then spread throughout New Zealand. My father was first of all married to Jane Dillon and when she died he married my mother who was an Amner from the Amners’ Lime Works in Napier. I had a sister and a brother. My sister was born in Napier. Although Mum was a Napier girl she was living in Waipawa, and all her children were born in the hospital in Napier and then a week later taken to Waipawa. And that was what happened to me, I was born in Napier and then taken … after Mum left hospital she went down to the house in Waipawa where we lived for many, many years.

So most of your growing up was in Central Hawke’s Bay in Waipawa. You went to school ..?

I went to school in Waipawa, the Waipawa District High School. I got my University Entrance exams there and my brother was there and my sister was there.

Did you play any sports while you were at Central Hawke’s Bay?

I played a lot of tennis. I was in the Hawke’s Bay tennis team for many, many years. I never played golf, played a wee bit of cricket but tennis was my main … my father ran the Waipawa Tennis Tournaments and then after I came home Harley Lewis and I ran the Waipawa Tennis Tournaments for many, many years. We ran the North Island championships. Oh, it was wonderful.

Yes. Growing up in Central Hawke’s Bay would have been quite a quiet little area. You would have been very dependent on one another for fun?

Yes. We spent most of our time down the river bed shooting rabbits with .22s. Oh, we spent most of our time before the war down the river bed.

So after you left school did you then go on to an office to train as an accountant or was that after the war?

No. I had to have a job to come home to so I joined the Public Trust in Waipukurau and I was there for about six months. I joined the Air Force and after four years I came home. For air crew you had to pass written assignments. I had all those completed while I was still at school and I just joined the Public Trust so I would have a job to go to when I came home.

So you always had a wish to join the Air Force obviously?

Well, my father was a very keen military man but I didn’t like the idea of the Army. It was either the Navy or the Air Force but I had two brothers already in the Air Force, so naturally the Air Force was my choice. But you know, when someone comes along to an 18 year old and says “join up and we’ll teach you to fly and take you round the world” – what choice have you got?

Absolutely. Now what about your brothers and sisters at this stage? You said two of your brothers were already in the Air Force – what were their names?

Chum – or Albert Eccles but known as Chum, and Henry William Amner known as Bill. Chum was the oldest of the lot – he was my half brother – he was the oldest, and he became a Flight Lieutenant. He was on Handley Page Hampdens flying 489 Squadron and he came back from the war. My other brother Bill was killed. He was converting from Wellingtons to Lancasters and he was doing a trip over the Welsh countryside, and they believe a photoflash bomb blew up and blew the tail off and he was killed.

So when you left New Zealand to train you said you’d done most of the papers that you needed to do to get into the Air Force, but you then had to embark on a training run didn’t you?

Yes, we joined the Air Force and we went first of all to Rotorua which was an ITW – an Initial Training Wing – at Rotorua. They had made Rotorua because there was a lot of hotels and that there that they just commandeered to look after us. There you just learnt the normal rules and regulations and laws of the Air Force. And from then I went to Bell Block airfield where I was training on Tiger Moths.

Bell Block – is that in New Plymouth?

New Plymouth. And I was training at Bell Block on Tiger Moths. Did about forty odd hours there I think. And then I went to Canada on the ‘Matsonia’ and after a while at Edmonton we were posted to Dunnville and I was flying Harvards and Yales. I got my wings in Canada, and we left Halifax on the ‘Queen Elizabeth’ and left from Canada and went to Gourock in Scotland and then down to Bournemouth.

Did all New Zealanders go through Canada to do their training?

Some trained in New Zealand and some trained in Canada. You had your choice of going to Canada or staying in New Zealand.

‘Cause most of the people I‘ve spoken to have all ended up in Canada, but as you said that was a choice.

Yeah they had a choice, but people who stayed home trained at Taieri in Tiger Moths. At Bournemouth – we were stationed there for quite a long time waiting to be posted. From there I went to OTU at Eshott, north of Newcastle and where I flew Spitfires first of all. Then we flew Miles Masters which was a much heavier, faster machine. I was flying Miles Masters and the Spitfire and then I joined 485 New Zealand Squadron when it were at Drem on rest after a hectic time on 11 Group down the south of England.

Max, it must have been quite a thrill or … when you converted from Harvards or those sorts of planes to the big powerful Spitfire.

Well that’s where the Miles Master – the Battle of Britain boys went straight from Harvards to Spitfires. We had the choice of going from Harvards to Miles Masters which was a twin engined, faster machine. It gave us some idea of a bit more powerful machine and then we went on to the Spitfire.

Once upon a time we thought a Cessna was powerful, or we thought a Percival Proctor was powerful. And so you had been flying Spitfires and …

We flew Spitfires right through to the end. And when we were in Belgium I think, they converted us to Tempests which was a much more powerful machine than the Spitfire.

Is that the American ..?

No, no. English. And then we went over to Predannack in Cornwall and I flew a Tempest for four hours and a Typhoon for half an hour. And then because of the mechanical problems the Tempests were having and the loss due to anti-aircraft they didn’t have enough Tempests to supply us, so we went back on to Spitfires. And there was a big party in the mess when we heard we were going back to Spitfires believe me. [Chuckle]

Because you were used to flying or were they a better plane to fly – the Spitfire?

Oh absolutely. We hated the Tempests. They were a much more powerful machine and faster of course but the old Spitfire was beautiful to fly.

Yes, so during the period of duties you had, obviously you probably did all sorts of various things. I noticed in that book from the RSA, you carried bombs which I didn’t realise …

Oh, yes. We were the first Spitfires Squadron to be made a Dive Bomber Squadron. We carried 500lb under the belly or 250 under each wing. And we used to go out dive bombing – mainly the buzz bomb sites in Calais, although it was a bit of a waste of time bombing them because they were just a concrete ramp going up like this, and they took off and you had to get them on the rail to do any good. Oh no, we did a lot of dive bombing. And then we just about … oh, two days off D-Day we were all set to go to D-Day and I flew up to Newchurch to see Maurice Mayston, he was a friend of mine from Waipawa. It was a grass ‘drome and I jumped off the Spitfire, put my foot in a hole and broke my ankle.

So that finished you for D-Day.

Well maybe it was fate, I don’t know. I was in hospital for about four weeks and I rejoined the Squadron in time to go over to France with them. The whole squad went over to Carpiquet Airfield in Normandy and we operated from there. We were attached to the Canadian Army doing close support to the Canadian Army. They would tell us what we used to have to bomb or what we had to … if they were having trouble with strafe. Quite often they would just put down smoke bombs, and we’d strafe.

So you were in support of them?

Absolutely, yes. They would capture an aerodrome and then we’d fly up and operate from it, and they’d move forward and capture another aerodrome. Now and again they’d just get a great big paddock, stick and anchor some netting down, and we’d fly off that. The Spitfire was such a wonderful plane, it would land on a sixpence. Tempest you needed the M1 to land on. [Chuckle]

Did you really? You must have had some happy times during the war but I guess there were also some very sad times too, because you would have had mates that weren’t there for mess in the morning.

But it never happened to you. It always happened to the other joker. There’s a book written by a friend of mine in Christchurch about McInnes – he was a bit of a mad man. He flew under the Severn Bridge and unfortunately there were two people working on it and they fell off, so he was put back into an LAC for six months and then he rejoined the squadron. And then we were at Fairwood Common practising dive bombing in Wales, and he did in his practise … did a slow roll and was too low and he killed himself.

Yes, it happened quite a lot, didn’t it, from some of our daring pilots.

Oh, yes, yes – crazy.

Yes. You were with the Air Force until the end of the war, and I guess when D-Day was pronounced that was it? That was the finish of the war wasn’t it. You didn’t probably go and do any more.

No, after D-Day … D-Day, well that was the start of the war as far as we were concerned and then the VE day was in Germany. We were in Germany on VE day, and then we stayed in Germany doing a lot of occupation work. We had very, very tight formation – twelve very, very tight formation flying over the big German cities just to show them who was boss.

A show of strength.

Yes. They had surrendered of course and we just kept flying over there showing the strength, you see. Montgomery was in charge so it was quite interesting there.

And so you kept doing that and obviously probably other duties until you were demobbed …

Oh yes.

… and put on a boat.

We came home on the ‘Andes’. We were twenty three days from Southampton to Melbourne – it was a world record. We were a day in Melbourne and we were five days crossing the Tasman because the wharfies wouldn’t unload us on Sunday, and Monday was Labour Day so we finally got in on Tuesday. [Chuckles]

You couldn’t win.

No.

Coming home – that must have been quite an experience after five years of the war, aeroplanes, bombing, flying. It must have been quite an experience to all of a sudden come home to peace and quiet and rejoin society. What was that like, Max?

It never worried me at all. I got my licence and flew in from Waipukurau, but I couldn’t afford it. You had to do twelve hours a year flying and I got everyone who wanted to fly to fly with me. I just couldn’t afford it.

Oh, I had an interesting time overseas there was no question about that. When Hitler made one attempt to throw us all back and he attacked through the Ardennes at the Battle of the Bulge, and then he attacked every airfield in the area. We were supposed to fly up to Gilze en Rijen and all our anti aircraft guns had gone up the night before so they were ready for us at Gilze en Rijen, and six 109s came over and we lost thirteen aircraft on the ground. Spitfires. Altogether we lost about two hundred planes, but the Hun lost about two hundred pilots, because he couldn’t do it. No, it was all very interesting.

Once we – Theo Kerrins and I were on stand by – it was a very, very foggy day and we got a scramble. There was three midget submarines had left Flushing Harbour and were sitting in the fog in the thing, and we were directed on to them and we sunk the three of them.

Well that would have been quite exciting.

It was.

‘Cause it wasn’t normally done was it, by fighters?

It’s the only time in the world that a Spitfire sunk a submarine.

And they were really quite big.

Oh, yes.

They weren’t as small as we think they are.

And another time we were – the River Rhine was the front line. We were this side, the Hun was that side. And the Yanks had captured a bridge at Cologne so we set out to dive bomb all the other bridges so that they couldn’t counter-attack. Ted Bennett, Bishop Bennett’s son, and I were sent out to dive bomb, and we dive bombed the bridge and I got hit by flak and I had to bail out. I knew I was on the right side but I landed and a joker in a green uniform and a guttural voice came up to me and I thought “Oh, God I’m on the wrong side” but he was a Dutch colonel. He’d seen me bale out and he followed me up and he was waiting for me when I landed.

Fascinating. It’s something you know, people of my era that were born too young to go to war could never imagine what it was like because you had to be there to understand it, didn’t you?

Yes. The Air Force was a fairly … oh, it was dangerous of course, but it was nothing like being on ground jobs. They had a terrible life.

Well they were in on everything that was happening around them, whereas I guess yours was out of sight.

Yes. We were in tents the whole time in France. The Canadians would capture an airfield and we’d move up, put our … the Erks would put our tents up and everything. There was three officers to a tent and they’d move up, move the tents up. We were in tents for a long time and it was bloody cold too. And mud – we were down by Armentieres and the mud was absolutely shocking. We had duck boards all over the place to walk otherwise you couldn’t have got through.

Yes. So then when you came back to New Zealand, did you go back to the Public Trust?

I went back to the Public Trust for a while where I met my wife who was a typist in the Public Trust. Then I sat my exams by correspondence through Hemingways, and after I qualified I joined the Styles & Hames who were above the Public Trust, so I joined them, and then I joined Robert Dobson & Co in Napier.

Coming back to your wife. She was a Waipawa girl?

Waipuk.

And so you were bringing the two cities together weren’t you?

Yes, I had an old Army Indian I’d bought. It was a despatch rider thing I’d bought from the War Assets Board for $40 and I had to travel over to Waipuk on that every day. I had to go courting with my wife, and I had to push it at night time so it wouldn’t make a row. I had to push it about five blocks. [Chuckle]

I know – they did make a lot of noise, you’re dead right. [Laughter]

We got married. We were married in 1950 at the St Joseph’s Church there. I had four kids – Rosemary, she’s living with me here now. Vivienne, she died about four years ago from a stroke, and Noel who’s in London and Diane who’s in Melbourne.

Have you been back to England at all?

Many times.

To look up old friends?

Oh, not really. Every time I went back the pommy ground staff organised a reunion. All the pommy ground staff would get together and I met them. And Tim Wallis was over there. We made him our patron.

Did you? Right.

You’re not fooled. [Laughter] And he was over there and I said “well, we’re going to have a squadron reunion, Tim – would you ..?” “I’ll come, ‘course I’ll come Max”. He was in a wheel chair and they brought him up and – oh, you should have seen … kow towing Sir – they thought he was marvellous.

So was he on active duty at the same time as you?

Oh, no no – he was much younger.

Yes, he didn’t actually … he wasn’t in the war at all, no. But he just became a peace time pilot. So they all thought he’d been …

Oh no, they knew he was – he wasn’t in the war but they … the thought of Sir Tim … it was quite interesting. Every time I went back to England they’d organise a reunion and we’d get together.

So did you do any flying after you came home from the war?

Yes I sent my log book down and they sent me a licence back, and I was flying at Waipuk for about three years I think. I couldn’t afford it – gosh, I was courting and I was studying and I didn’t have any money.

Well, even although it didn’t seem much per hour it was a lot because it was on top of every other cost you had.

Oh, yes. I flew everyone who wanted to fly. They’d ring me up and say “I want to go fly.” So I’d fly them and they’d pay for it. That’s how I lasted about three years but then I had to chuck it in.

So you did your time in Waipawa, was it – with the accountants’ firm?

Waipuk. I lived in Waipawa – the accountants’ firm was in Waipuk.

You said you did your time by correspondence with …

Hemingways.

You used to see that in magazines everywhere – correspondence course – I haven’t heard that name for years. I assume they’ve gone now have they?

Oh, yes. They all go to night school, or … There was no night school when we were there.

But that was the only way you could …

The only way you could pass exams.

So then once you finished in Waipuk you then moved to Robert Dobson in Napier.

1952 we came up here.

And you’ve continued to practise as an accountant in Napier during that period. Later on I think you said you were taken over by …

Oh – I started over at Robert Dobson & Co. then it became Wilkinson, Nankervis & Stewart, and then we became Arthur Young, then we became Ernst Young, so … at that stage I got out, computers had taken over. [Chuckle]

Well, you became absorbed by other companies. Now during this period you’ve also had a great love for … an association with the RSA.

Yes.

In various forms. Tell me about it because, you know – it’s a long period that you’ve been …

I was secretary of the Waipuk RSA – after the war I joined up and I became secretary of the Waipuk RSA. And then I came to Napier and I joined the RSA here, and I did the books for about thirty years. And they made me a life member.

And do you still go down to the RSA?

Not so much now that I’m here. I go there for lunch now and again. I had a very … quite a wonderful war really. I got an MID out of it and …

And you came back.

… I came back, yes.

It’s interesting to see how the RSA are losing members. I’ve been an RSA member – I’d been trained but I would have gone to the Vietnam war which finished before I was ready to go but I go along now and again to Hastings and it’s just really quite sad to see how few of the old faces are still there.

Oh yes, very, very few of the original RSA members left now.

And of course the drink driving laws have changed the whole …

Killed the whole thing. Yeah, a lot of the RSA’s are just collapsing.

So obviously at some stage in the last few years your wife passed away?

Yes, she died about four years ago. We were married for sixty one years, and then she died of a stroke about four years ago.

And then eventually you moved to Summerset. It’s a wonderful complex, the way they set them out, isn’t it?

Yes. My son paid a deposit on it without telling me.

Did he now! You were shafted!

And when one came due he had to tell me, and I said “I can look after Noeline”. He said “You can’t”, and this went on for half an hour – “I can.” “You can’t.” “I can.” “You can’t.” In the end I had to give in, but I’ve never regretted it.

No. Oh, that’s great. Where does he live?

He lives in London.

What does he do in London?

Oh, he worked for Lloyds’ Insurance at one stage.

Well that’s a pretty good position to be in.

He’s working from home now.

So he must be climbing on in years too I guess?

He’s 55 – 56 or something, yes. He got married in Napier here about three years ago. He’s a very – he was a keen yachtsman. He did four of these famous yacht races from England to Ireland and back again. He did three or four of those, and he had a 60ft yacht or something, but he got rid of that and he … now flying. He’s got a lot of hours on flying and his wife has got a lot more hours than he has on flying. And when they came out here they did a lot of flying at Waipuk on Tiger Moths, to get the experience. When he first came home he would hire a plane and he’d take me up and I’d take over and I’d fly it, and he … he got a bit annoyed about that. [Chuckle]

So is there anything else you can think of Max, because you’ve had a very broad experience of life and obviously still have good health.

I still have very good health, yeah – I’m very, very fortunate about that. Oh, we used to do the same – we used to do a lot of duck shooting. My brother-in-law had a farm out at Elsthorpe.

Whereabouts in Elsthorpe was he? What was his name?

Bibby.  Eric.

I know most of the Bibbys, but that’s the one I don’t know.

He and … his father and Prentice had a partnership, Bibby and Prentice, and then the Prentice dropped out and Eric took over the farm. It’s about four miles from Kairakau beach.

I always remember Kairakau beach, I went out to sell one of the Bibby’s beach houses on the beach.

That was Eric.

Was it? Anyway it belonged to his son, Peter.

Well see – my sister married Eric Bibby that’s where Geoff and I are very close together, you see.

Geoff’s a gentleman isn’t he.

Oh yes, sometimes.

Oh, no – I’ve had a very, very interesting career. We did a lot of travel after the war, when the practice sort of got so big, you know, they paid a lot of our travel and we travelled South Africa and Europe and Greece. Gets very addictive, travel.

Yes it does. You said you never played golf – you played tennis. Did you play tennis after you came back from the war?

Yes. I ran the tournaments in Waipawa and then I played in the tournaments here but then I came up to Napier and joined the Hawke’s Bay Tennis Club here, and I was on the Hawke’s Bay tennis team for – oh, many years. Earl Denford and Jack Charters.

Yes, well Earl died just recently didn’t he?

Yes, I know, I went to Earl’s funeral too.

Okay. Unless there is something else you can think of …

I’ll most probably think of everything else after you’ve gone.

We can always do what we call an addendum and stitch something on the end of it, ’cause …

No, I don’t think so.

After I joined the squadron and we went down to Hornchurch, the Luftwaffe had just about been thrown out of the sky. I only saw about four aircraft in the air at once. But even so I was still credited with four aircraft destroyed. Unfortunately they were all ours. Yeah, Geoff has me on about that.

You just mentioned that you knew Ken Parrish. He was in the Pathfinder squadron wasn’t he.

He was on Mosquitos wasn’t he?

You knew him during the war time, or after you came back?

After he came back. I didn’t know him very well, I knew of him and I’d met him, you know, but … I think I’m the last Spitfire pilot left in Hawke’s Bay now – the last Spitfire pilot left in Hawke’s Bay I think. There’s a Tempest pilot and a Corsair pilot still alive.

‘Course John Caulton was a Spitfire pilot. He’s gone.

Yes, he’s gone. We’re an old breed now.

Certainly are. A lot of us can thank our lucky stars there were so many of you that gave your time and so many gave their lives.

Yeah. That’s right.

All right, well thank you very much for that. If there’s anything else Max, we can always do an addendum.

This is an addendum to the previously recorded conversation. Would you like to just tell me Max, about that experience?

We were stationed at Fassberg – it was in the middle of Germany. It was a big Luftwaffe ”drome there, and we were about to leave the aerodrome and I looked under my bed, and I saw a German Officer’s logbook. I thought this would be good to have so I brought it home with me, and I had it at home for about forty years. And then I wrote to the German Embassy and told them about it, and asked if they could find the owner. I got a letter back oh, about six weeks later to say they’d contacted him, and gave me his address. So I sent it over, and there was a big article in the newspaper about it here, and everything. And he wrote back and he sent me a photo of himself, and he sent me a photo of a painting he’d drawn, and we corresponded regularly by Christmas cards, ’til about the last three or four years I haven’t had one, so he must have passed away.

Interesting story isn’t it? [Chuckle] Especially … different sides of the fence. There you are corresponding with one another.

Yeah. I’ve got a copy of the article on it somewhere.

Yes. Okay.