Jones, Lynda (Havelock North Function Centre) Interview

Today is Monday 18th December 2023. I’m Maxine Rose, and I’m with Lynda Jones, co-manager of the Havelock North Function Centre. Lynda, in September this year the Function Centre marked a very important anniversary … twenty-five years since it was opened in 1998. But you too have an important milestone coming up – your retirement and departure from your role as co-manager after twenty-three years, so you’re the perfect person to tell me about how it all began. Details are well documented, but it’s important to actually hear from those who were around at the time. So let’s start back in 1989 when the Havelock North Borough Council and the Hastings District Council amalgamated, and it was announced that the Council Chambers – a long-time venue for community gatherings, dances and even Sunday morning Mass – were to be demolished, triggering the need for a new community centre. I understand there was a demolition party; tell me what happened at that?

Well that is, I suppose, where the idea really started to crystallise. And the story is told that Mark von Dadelszen and Cyril Whittaker, and … for some reason I do believe Paris Magdalinos, the architect, was actually there as well; and there was sort of like a chat, and pretty much by the end of that demolition party the concept of building a community centre was well and truly established, shall we say? And it really just went on from that; I mean, yes, the Borough Council had discussed the idea, but that’s all it was. And it took that next step … and I guess, you know, the Borough Council Chambers were a well-loved premises as you’ve said, used for a number of things in the community … and I think that really solidified that there was a real need to do something different.

What was the mood of the people that were there? Were they sad?

Definitely sad that the old Chambers were going. It was still in the time where people were just getting used to the fact that the Borough Council itself had been dissolved, you know, so I guess that also helps to fuel a new beginning.

How was it decided exactly what form the new centre would take, because it was modified several times, wasn’t it?

There was a public consultation process which included questionnaires; first of all, you know, do you want it? [Chuckle] And a number of people said, “No. No, we’ve got St Columba’s Hall and St Luke’s Hall for whatever time we’ve got”, you know, “the Council Chambers.” And there’s another hall … [the] name escapes me just at this moment. So it was sort of felt that – the Scout Hall – there were enough, you know. So the questionnaire did present some people who were naysayers for sure, but in the long run it was, “Yes – what a good idea.” I don’t know whether it was, “Yes, what a good idea, but don’t ask me for money”, or quite what, but anyway it was great; it was a public consultation that occurred; there was a public meeting where you know, plans were sort of quite specific about what the place would be used for and how it would be configured etcetera. So that was good; that brought out both sides very well, and any you know, written submissions as well about ideas for how it would work, where it would work, why it would work, who was going to run it and who was going to pay for it. So looking back, I think it was a very good consultation process, and everybody had the opportunity to have something to do [with it]. I wasn’t involved in any of this at the time, but I remember as a member of the public seeing all this and thinking, ‘Oh’, you know, ‘that’s interesting.’ You know, I noticed that it was going on.

I hadn’t realised that there were other venues; I sort of got the impression that there was nothing left after, but you’re saying there were other halls.

There were, because St Columba’s Hall was here when this place opened; it still was across the road there. And there was the hall at St Luke’s as well, so yes there were; and the Scout Hall which is still here as well. There were places, but I think that what happened was that when the library was built then it was a very nice building … beautifully architecturally designed, and it was lovely. The other halls were all just halls; they were bare boards and you know, church halls tend to be minimal, as do Scout halls. And that I think also just helped to fuel the idea of, ‘No, we need a proper community hall or centre of some sort.’

So what were some of the suggestions of things that were needed? Obviously, you know, a one-up over space, but what were the specifics that people thought?

I think somewhere where everything could happen, and that’s why in the initial plans there was everything from a very large theatre at the back to the Lantern Gallery as it’s now, you know, still called, as an art gallery. It was very much driven by that whole ethos of ‘The Havelock Work’ from early days, that cultural things needed to be facilitated, and that the big room which was originally called the Function Room and is now the Magdalinos Room – that’s our biggest room – that would be ideal for concerts – and also in the gallery for smaller concerts. But that whole cultural thing was there; probably back then there was less emphasis on the commercial world actually using a venue like a community hall for holding seminars. You didn’t actually hold as many seminars back in those days as businesses now do, so it was perhaps more that cultural and recreational [use] from the service organisations – places like Rotary and Lions to hold their things, as well as a myriad of community groups like, you know, groups such as Probus … now they’re called Rebus … and U3A [University of the Third Age], and smaller groups who just want to get together either on a regular basis or as one-offs. So it was more recreational and cultural to start off with, and it was also in mind that the corporate world would also use it.

Lots of different agendas, really?

Absolutely; this is why the design of the building was for different sized rooms, because it’s everything from a small group to a very large group; [it] was always seen as being something that was needed, and that if you’re going to do the job [you’re] going to do it well. And to this day I have to say that the design of the building works brilliantly, and we have people from outside of the area, particularly conference organisers who would just love to pick up the whole place, carpark included, and transport it to their city, usually Auckland [or] Wellington, because it’s just so well built in terms of the design, and you know, everything is really very good – we’ve been very fortunate.

That’s great to hear. At what stage was it decided for the centre to be combined with the library?

Well I think it was first floated way back in the 1970s that that was the logical sort of thing to do once the library was built, you know, to then join on a community centre; it seemed to be the logical place, ‘cause by that time the library was well in operation – it was sort of acting very much as the community hub because people gathered there, you know, and they had a lovely place to go and be. And I think it came from there, and again, solidified in 1992 when the Parkwood closed and this emphasised the need. So that was another venue that was actually used, perhaps more for the seminars for the corporate world … the Parkwood Hotel.

What was the Parkwood?

It was a hotel – it’s where Mary Doyle Rest Home now is. Yes, so there was accommodation there as well as a conference venue. Yes.

So once an architect had been chosen – and you’ve mentioned Paris Magdalinos who was obviously, you know, involved – and plans were finalised, funding finally got underway in 1994. Tell me about the funding process and where the money came from?

Well we have to first of all give big dibs to the Hastings District Council because they did provide the land, which obviously was also the same land as the library had been built on. They also gave just under $1 million; now this became a combined project, because the need was seen by the late 1980s for an archive room at the library. So there was the idea of building an archive room onto the library and then joining the community centre to the library. And they came up with that amount of money mainly from the sale of surplus Havelock North property that they held at the time. And towards the completion of the funding process they [the council] donated a further $189,000 from its own surplus that enabled the big room.

Now one of our current trustees is Lawrence Yule, who happens to be the former mayor of Hastings, and he giggled his head off at this idea, because of course what council now has a surplus? Quite the opposite; so Hastings District Council enabled it to happen.

But the other important part of the slice is that the community raised well over $500,000, and back in the 1990s that was a lot of money. A fundraising committee was formed by Cyril Whittaker, who actually later became a chairman of the Trust Board. And included in the fundraising committee was Brian Higgins; he actually became the first chairman of the Trust once the place opened – he took over from Mark von Dadelszen, who stood down as chairman. So those two men were integrally involved right at the start, and they understood the process involved in bringing the community centre into being.

The fundraising committee were responsible for applying for grants … places like the Lotteries Commission, the Eastern & Central Community Trust, Sir James Wattie Memorial Trust – and we of course have our Sir James Wattie Room. And Sir James Wattie Trust has always been notorious [famous] for giving money for community projects, and we have a large picture of Sir James in the Wattie Room as a perpetual memorial to him; and thanks to the Trust for putting money up. Various organisations came to the party, as did a lot of individuals, so the fundraising committee did that side of things.

But the other side of things that they did is get into the business world. There was a lot of business sponsorship that they were able to encourage – and encourage is the right word, because the business community were pretty badly hit at the time; there’d been a horrible hail stone [hail storm] that really made it difficult for the whole place.

But however, the retailers got behind it; the Rose & Shamrock Irish pub had an opening evening from which was raised $10,000; again, that is an immense amount of money to raise in one evening, you know, and they donated that. The Village Court retailers gave a percentage of their monthly takings for six months, you know, and that was $500 a month; well, again, that added up, you know, when times were difficult. You know, we all understand difficult economic times, and that again was a huge commitment by them. And individual businesses and individual donors all [paper shuffling] came to the party.

And then we come in a way to the most important of the lot, and that was the events that were held as fundraising events. And these ranged right from children holding lemonade stalls at the end of their driveways, to schools doing coin trails, to some rather bigger occasions. There were a lot of concerts; Patricia Payne, New Zealand’s mezzo soprano, did a whole performance at the … what was it called? Hastings Municipal Theatre in those days, and you know, a huge percentage of that came to the fund. There were a lot of smaller concerts held in various places which again were used for fundraising; choral performances; some people held home musical soirées, you know – just such a quaint concept seen from 2023, but how lovely. People held neighbourhood barbecues … same thing, you know, you …

There was a fair, wasn’t there?

There were two village fairs, and they were very successful in raising good amounts. There were donation boxes everywhere, there were Christmas street parties, lots of raffles all over the show. The service clubs did a lot of cold calling phone contact sort of thing … these things take a lot of time. There was a fashion parade, a golf tournament; there was a Top Town event as well, and there was a very swish cocktail party held at the Assembly Rooms. There was a celebrity debate; there were just coffee groups; Duart House had a garden party, and they used to hold musical and games evenings up there at Duart. And the village fairs, yes, were a huge one. Oh, and one of the other ones was the ‘Buy a Brick’ … so you could buy a concrete block and you could just choose to donate $5 if you wanted to, and you pledged your $5 and you literally bought a brick, or you could pledge as much or as little as you want[ed] – the expectation was to just literally build the place brick by brick. And I think that was very successful, so … absolutely huge amount of fundraising. The community feels it built this place, and therefore they have a certain sense of ownership and pride in the building, and that continues to this day.

I think as a relative newcomer, you know, you can feel that, in the naming of the rooms and just that overall feeling of a community involved; so it’s well-named, isn’t it? The Community Centre …

Absolutely. That’s right.

It is a community centre. I think this is quite remarkable – I read that once construction was underway in Spring ‘97, the project took only a year until completion – that’s quite remarkable. Tell me about opening day, 12th September 1998.

Just back to your ‘one year’, I’d like to say that S E Morgan & Sons … one of the people who was involved in that is Mark Morgan; well he was one of the brothers in the Morgan business, and he is still a trustee with us to this day. It’s been invaluable having Mark on board because he knows every nook and cranny of the place – how it works and why it works, and what sort of tiles we’ve got, and every time we do an improvement, you know, we can just simply talk to Mark. “Would this be possible?” You know, “How can we do this? Is that something that can happen?” And that would include things like putting solar panels up on the roof, which is [a] possibility; so all that.

So once we got there, the place, you know, was a bare shell when it opened, but it was filled with people because … well, you had three hundred people coming to the actual event. The programme basically included things such as a Maori welcome and blessing by kaumatua, Jerry Hapuku, who’s still involved with the area of course. It was officially opened by mayor Jeremy Dwyer, who also planted a tree out there. Jeremy was always incredibly supportive of this project; he saw the value of it, as he did with a whole lot of other community projects that we’re very fortunate to have. There was a ceremonial flag raising by Doctor Tony Reeve, a long-standing doctor in the area, with Dudley Fickling in attendance, Katie Nimon and Rose Lay. The story of the community partnership as he discussed it … Jeremy, when he opened it … was talked about, so that there was that inclusive sort of sense in the opening. There was a prayer by Father Pat Cook, and there were items by the Havelock North School Choir. And they took this opportunity to introduce the caterers at the time, because I think everybody wondered how all that was going to happen, so that was a really good opportunity.

And then following the formal opening the place was opened to the public for at least a week. And I remember, ‘cause I wasn’t here in those days, but I remember I was working for the Hastings Library and there was a day when my boss and I came out to have a look at it, because I was the community librarian. So I remember coming and thinking, ‘Oh wow! What a fabulous place!’ And it was a bare shell; there were flowers everywhere, ‘cause over that week they had various people just, you know playing music … cellists, and various things sort of happening; a series of different people performing, sort of like, reflect[ing] that cultural value. And there were all sorts of choirs, and schools singing, youth orchestras … just various things that again, gave that sense of it being community involvement, cultural involvement. So it’s ironic that I actually came during that first week, never dreaming that I was [would] one day be here for a number of years.

The other thing that was on that week and part of the opening was an art exhibition in the Lantern Gallery which I say is in keeping with ‘The Havelock Work’, and this was organised by Rachel Coxhead and Patricia Davidson, and the guest artist was Geoff Fuller. Now Geoff Fuller was a very renowned New Zealand level artist who lived in Havelock North; he’s responsible for having designed the Havelock North Borough Coat [of] Arms which we have on display here in our showcase, along with the mayoral chain and things from the Havelock Borough Council. So that was a nice tying in of the past with the evolution of this place.

So a real sense of pride basically, isn’t it?

Absolutely, very much so, yes.

You mentioned music two or three times, and I know the community centre is extremely fortunate to own a particularly beautiful Steinway piano. Who originally owned that piano?

That’s a good story in itself. A gentleman named Frank Meissner – he was Austrian-born, and he came out to New Zealand for health reasons; the New Zealand climate was going to be good for him. He eventually bought an orchard in Te Mata Road, and he worked very hard. Eventually in the late 1950s Mr Meissner had enough money to either go back to Austria, which of course, in those days you didn’t pop back[wards] and forwards like we do now, or to buy a piano. And he chose to buy a piano. He bought a Steinway, and it was reputedly the first Steinway to be purchased for a private home in New Zealand, which is quite something, you know? This Mr Meissner … and he loved his piano; he played it every day. Before retiring for the night he played his favourite Chopin music – in 1959 this was – and he locked the piano up as he always did, went to bed and died in his sleep. And so you know, in a way it’s quite a lovely story that that’s how he passed. He had two sons and a daughter; none of them played any music whatsoever, but his daughter did polish the piano faithfully. And they didn’t have children themselves, so at a point where the family home was sold lots of people were interested in buying this piano but they decided they’d like it to stay in Havelock North, and it was offered to the trustees of the community centre. It was offered for about a third of what it was actually worth, and a very generous Havelock North citizen actually offered to pay for that, or to lend the money. And then over a period of years the ‘Around the Piano’ concerts, which were a monthly concert … the money from those, you know, eventually paid that back which was an amazing thing once again.

Great generosity from a citizen and a family, I guess, as well.

That’s right. But even more remarkable, I’ve noticed that it can be moved, you know, to any of the meeting rooms in the complex, so …

Who was responsible for that?

Well again, very fortunate – a retired engineer, Mr Harold Stuart, came up with the idea, and he designed and built a moveable platform which enables us to, if you like, ‘levitate’ a five hundred kilogram piano. [Chuckle] Basically we launch it like you would launch a boat; so it goes from ground level up three steps into the Magdalinos Room when it needs to. It’s like launching a boat into the sea – it used exactly the same idea – we wind it up and wind it back again. It’s a [an] engineering marvel, really, and we’re very grateful. Between Cyril Whittaker and Harold, they were experts at operating that, and I’d like to say it’s only been semi-dropped once in twenty-five years, and that caused no problem. But we worked out if it comes off its track in that process, we now know how to get it back on again using a car jack, I might say. But we’ve always had experts who are very good at moving the piano; it’s quite an art ‘cause you’ve got actually one centimetre on either side to get it up through the doors. So it’s quite a feat, to be sure. We’re very thankful to have had volunteers who have come in from time to time, and they move the piano for us. We’re also thankful to the people who’ve run the lunch hour concerts every month for the best part of probably twenty-two years … probably about twenty-four years to be honest. And Eileen von Dadelszen was involved, Richard Hewitt, Alex Burns; and now Beverley Heard and Ken Keys. And without them these concerts wouldn’t happen, and they bring great enjoyment to a wide ranging audience.

It is a beautiful sound from that piano, absolutely. Before we leave the actual venue, one aspect of the original complex was the idea of a theatre that would seat about three hundred people, and it didn’t ever happen. Why was that?

I think the simple answer [to] that is money. It was felt, I think, that we had reached our limit with doing it here; that extra $189,000 that was donated by council actually enabled the big room to be built, so I guess costs went up.

Where would it’ve been?

It would’ve been on the back of the big room that is currently there. So yes, there would still be room to put it on, but I personally don’t think it’ll happen because since then we’ve had the live theatre built up at Iona College which very much takes the place of such a thing. And I believe Hereworth [School] is also building a theatre. So they’re there, and of course Toitoi complex in Hastings – there’s not quite that same divide between Havelock North and Hastings as there was back then. So now I think, we in Havelock sort of feel that Toitoi is as much ours, whereas in those days the Hastings Municipal Theatre was the [for] Hastings and we should have our own, sort of thing, out here. So things’ve changed just a little bit.

Perhaps the Arts Festival has had a little bit to do with that too.

Yes, I believe you’d be right about that.

So now we come to you … tell me a little bit about your life and how you came to be co-manager.

[Chuckle] I started off as a primary school teacher, and then I was an employment officer in the days when we were actually paid to find people jobs, not just to put them onto Social Welfare … the two were completely different. Then I became what I call a fake school librarian because I wasn’t actually a trained librarian, but the teaching background … that was at Boys’ High, followed by the Hastings Library … swanned in just after they’d tripled themselves in size and they were all suffering stress from the building. And I sort of went in as the community librarian, which meant I did a lot of liaising with groups in the community about the services that libraries offer. I don’t know … I always remember giving talks about – this is back you know, sort of in the 1990s – “You do know that one day you’ll sit up in bed with your own computer in front of you, and you’ll be watching or reading your book on that thing; and your husband’ll be perched up in bed with you.” You know? And everybody used to go into fits of laughter at the thought. Well hello, folks [chuckle] … here we are. Anyway, that was what I was doing.

Then I had to have some time off with a health issue. During that time off I happened to go and buy fish and chips one night here in the Havelock North fish and chip shop, and met Kath La Rooy. And I’d seen in the paper that she had just been appointed as the first manager of the Havelock North Community Centre. I knew Kath from her job in the Hastings Art Gallery, and we used to do a bit of promotional work together; she’d put a display up in my library, so she was one of the groups that I liaised with. So I congratulated her, and then in the next breath I said, “Look, at present I’m having time out, but if you ever need anybody just to come in for a couple of hours, you know, to be there …” And two weeks later I was here. [Laughter] So that’s how I got the job.

And I suppose, you know, the things that I’ve mentioned have all been people-oriented sort of jobs, which I have loved. And it just sort of felt like the right thing, and the Trust Board at the time thought I might be okay as well, so here I am twenty-three years later.

Tell me some of the things that your role entails?

Well, your bread and butter is the fact you’re taking bookings and just making sure that every person who hires a room here has the very best experience they can possibly have. I think that that’s the number one thing; so the way you take the bookings, the emails you send, the phone calls, the little details, the pre-empting things that might or might not happen, recommending which room’s going to work the best in what way, you know – a lot involved in doing that. It’s hospitality at its most organised, if you like, you know, to make sure the hirer’s needs are fulfilled. They don’t always know what they really need to make something work, so communication’s the name of the game. That’s the bread and butter.

I do spend a fair amount of my time with my co-managers, you know, doing things like clearing leaves out of gutters in the rain, and … you know people think that all we do is sit behind the front desk there looking beautiful or otherwise. And really we’re often heads down, bottoms up in the air sort of, you know, in the pouring rain, you know, doing things like that because that’s what needed, you know. So we are dealing with a lot of technical things; as the years have gone by we’ve made a lot of improvements to the building as money has enabled us to. So we’ve had to learn how to use new heating and air conditioning systems and gadgets … our overhead projectors … we’ve kept up with technology, so we have to keep up with our technology as well as best we can for our hirers … obviously everything is for the good of our hirers.

And then of course there’s the report writing side of things, because even though we are not part of council the building was actually gifted back to council by the Trust. So it was fund raised by the community, then it was gifted back; so we actually technically lease this from the council.

Why was that?

Probably for upkeep. So the council does the upkeep of the outside of the building, and they are responsible for, say, replacing the carpet. We would replace tables and chairs and anything that moves out, but they are responsible for replacement stuff of the carpets. And we have a very good relationship with the council; we do a lot of shared projects with them. So that’s another part of the job, is that when we see there’s the money … for example the entire carpark. We gathered our funds together and we paid fifty percent of forming our own sixty car carpark, along with council.

So that is used by anybody?

No. Well they do use it, but we do have a sign up saying, ‘This is a Function Centre Carpark’; we don’t mind if there’s nobody here, but how do they know there’s not somebody coming in? How do they know if there’s not two hundred people coming in to a funeral? So it’s a bit of a shady area, but technically it is our carpark.

‘Cause I notice about three o’clock it’s well used by parents, you know, picking … I guess that’s only for a brief time, isn’t it?

That’s right, that’s right. And we all know that, so it’s fine.

Do you have any idea how many people on average would use the facility each week?

Probably around the eight hundred to a thousand mark I would say … that’s on an average. We have very busy periods and then we have quite slack periods, because the use of the centre has evolved into perhaps more for the corporate world, as well as recreation or organisations and community groups. So [the] corporate world does not tend to hold seminars during December, January or even February. This year with the cyclone, it was like they were running a month late because they didn’t get them done in February or March, so we had a real run on towards the end of the year. So yes, that would be about on an average probably eight hundred to a thousand a week, which is quite a lot of people.

It’s a lot of people for you to deal with really …

Mmm – given that some of those people are four people big, and then others are up to three hundred people big, so your events are very varied.

Any notable events that stand out for you?

[Chuckle] There’s always notable events, but some of them are just interesting ones. I remember having an Early Childhood national conference here some time ago now, and the whole place … they had a circus theme; being teachers they had to have a theme, and they decked the whole place out like a circus tent. It was pretty amazing – every room just had that theme. [A] lot of work; it just looked amazing.

But we’ve had interesting times where we’ve seen the place take on a steam punk theme, for example. And … oh, we did have the National Party caucus here about six years ago, I think it was, and that was during the summer where we had all those thirty-five and thirty-six degree days. And I did have fantasies about Judith Collins and Paula Bennett in their bikinis out on the front lawn under a sprinkler, but that one didn’t ever quite happen. But it was sweltering, and at the time I have to say that we did not have the air conditioning system that we currently have, and it was a bit rough, particularly as these people insisted on wearing suits, you know … their status in the community.

But you know, just recently we had, for example, the Hawke’s Bay Robotics Championships, so you know, the place was filled with these robotic things that kids are making. So we have a lot of variation when we see all these things. And various groups, you know, Samoan church groups and things like that, which add a lovely flavour to the place, you know, being used by those groups as well as kids – we love to see kids come in here. We do have the ‘Little Magpies’ yoga group, which are pre-school yoga kids who come in here.

So given that this is an archive interview, tell me about photographic evidence of some of these events … do you take photographs?

When we remember too … because I’m an older person I have to say that it’s always the last thing I think of doing, is actually taking a photo. But the value of the twenty-fifth birthday was to realise that we need more photos. The next co-manager when I retire … we must make sure we keep up our photo logs. For example, no, I don’t have a photo of when the whole place was decked out; we didn’t have our iPhones in those days, you know? We didn’t just do that. So we have lost a bit of pictorial stuff of events, but … note to self, you know, about taking more photos.

So an oral archive becomes more important in that respect, doesn’t it?

Absolutely correct.

You’ve touched on this I think – the fact that you have an excellent caterer, so Pure Catering, and that there’s ample car parking. And you’ve said that there have been people who would like to pick it up, so that’s a really positive note to end this interview. Just tell me how that feels when you have a successful event.

Well, that’s exactly how it does feel, and I have to say that the caterers are really, really important in all of that, because you know yourself what it’s like – you go to anything and if you have a really nice morning tea, really nice lunch let alone a really nice dinner provided … it’s all warm fuzzies all the way round. And that’s why our caterers – we started with Regal Catering with Hugh and Norma Thornton, and they were the most convivial of all people; the perfect couple for this place when it first opened because you needed the sort of people who would do whatever it took. Their fare was relatively plain by today’s standards, but it was beautiful, and it was their friendly, welcoming attitude – Hugh had the attitude of … well, you say “Yes”, and then you work out how the heck you’re going to do it. And we did have a lot of laughs, Hugh and I, about how we were going to do these things, but it always worked.

And when they retired, Pure Catering with Dale and Jeremy Rimene came on board, and they’re like a younger version of Hugh and Norma. S -o we’re very, very fortunate to have them. While Hugh and Norma were fairly basic in their catering which was the style at the time – Pure can go up as far as you want them to, and they more than cater for all the needs of all our hirers. And again, that welcoming, ‘can do’ attitude … you know, it’s very, very successful. If we didn’t have good caterers it just wouldn’t be the same; we’re not just a building, we’re a place. And everything must work well together, from the role of the manager to our caterers, to our Trust Board who are always very supportive of everything that we suggest. And we’ve a very strong relationship; plus the council, so I mean, it’s just been a success story.

We do get a community grant from the council still, and they hold us up as quite an exemplary example of how a community partnership should work with council. We don’t get a lot compared to others, but we have their support which we’re very thankful for. But the fact [that] we do so many projects in partnership with them, you know … when we ask for something they say, “Yes”, ‘cause we say, “We’ll pay half”. You know, it’s gone from strength to strength.

And in no small measure, due to you by the sound of it; so what does life hold now?

Well my plans for retiring are to have absolutely zero plans. [Laughter] I know everybody says that, but you know … there are things that will happen, like being a grandma … but just not having a structure will be wonderful. When I’m ready to have a structure again I will have it. And I do a lot of reading, and I write, so I know that those things will get more time. And I do like to garden, and it will be nice to do these things in my time, and not fit them in between what else I’m doing.

Well, I think that’s a lovely note to end on; I wish you all the best in your retirement, and thank you so much, it’s been fascinating listening to you. Thanks, Lynda.