Lindstrom, Graham Lawrence Interview

Good morning. Today is Thursday 4th February 2021. I’m about to interview Graham Lindstrom. Graham’s going to talk to us about growing up in Wairoa; he was born in Gisborne and then transferred back to Wairoa; so now I’m going to let him tell you his story.

[Some initial interference]

Yeah, well we came back to Wairoa after I was born; and when I was five my mother and father bought the Morere tearooms, and we went there in 1938 and I went to school at Morere ‘til ‘bout 1944, I think, and then the Morere School closed down and we went to Nuhaka School. Went to Nuhaka Public School – there was [were] two schools at Nuhaka; there was a Native School and a Public School, which we attended. There was about sixty kids I think, there when I was there and I think at the Native School, I think there was about a hundred and forty, something like that, from what I can remember. And we used to leave home at Morere at quarter past seven in the morning, catch the school bus which came to Wairoa to the high school, and then we’d go to Nuhaka; we’d be at Nuhaka at half past seven, twenty to eight, and we’d have to walk from the main road to Gisborne across on the Mahia road to where our school was, over on the other side of the river at Nuhaka. And we’d be there, and then we’d catch the bus again on the way home ‘bout quarter past four, and get home ‘bout five o’clock. So for five miles we were away for a long time for our schooling. Yeah, but it was good, yeah. And I can remember at Morere when South’s store was burnt down; I can remember my father lassoing the safe with a number eight wire, and pulling it out of the burning building. And I think the bloke that burnt the store down got caught, and I think I went to school with his son at the Morere School for a while, but that’s a bit hazy there; but I think his name was Kirk.

You’re correct, that’s what was in the newspaper.

Was it? Yeah, well I sort of can remember, and I knew where they lived; I can still see where they lived, and I’m sure I went to school with … and I think he did jail out of it anyway. Yeah, but the store – well, it was built again after that and it’s still standing there today. It was a post office, general store … sold everything from needle to a haystack. And Mr South, I think he left there and went to Gisborne, must have been about 19 … no, I’m not sure about it now; no, I’m not sure of those dates. He was there for a long time, you know, they were in Morere longer than we were.

And of course our tearooms was [were] opposite the Morere baths, and me and my brother, [my brother and I] could swim like fish, ‘cause we were always in the baths at Morere and in the bush, hunting. So we were only young blokes, but we were sort of … an upbringing in the wild, sort of style, yeah. And unfortunately my father died in 1946; I was twelve, my brother was ten and my sister was about two; and Mum … the war years … had to struggle and bring us up. And she kept the shop going, and the tearooms going with the help of some … people used to come, sisters and [relatives] used to come and help at the busy times over the Christmas and New Year times. Morere was a very busy place in those years; the hotel was there, and then of course the American Army – they landed in Opoutama, and they were always at the pub in the bars, so it was a very busy spot.

Anyway, I came to town about 1949 to be an apprentice electrician; served my time in Wairoa. Then my mother held on to the shop and store ‘til about 1950, then she closed down; couldn’t sell it. It was closed, and then she took over the manager [management] of Osler’s Bakery’s depot at Nuhaka, and my brother and sister were there with her then. Yeah, so I stayed in Wairoa for about, I think seven years, and then I went to Gisborne to further my knowledge in the electrical field; and then got married … married [a] Wairoa girl, Valerie Osler … came back to Wairoa and we built out house, and we still live in it today; sixty years we’ve been in this house. Mmm.

And over that time Val and I had four kids, two boys and two girls. Two of them are teachers, one’s a builder and one’s an electrician and lives in Sweden, but he comes occasionally to see us; every two-odd years or so they usually pop out. We’ve been over there three times I think, Val and I, and we’ve had a few trips around the world in our time. And we had an experience the last time when our youngest daughter was teaching in Singapore; we went over there for a holiday and she talked us into having a cruise on a ship. So we had the cruise on this ship, and the ship caught on fire and sunk; and we were floating around the ocean in lifeboats for about five to six hours. We lost everything we owned; ship went to the bottom – no deaths – there was eleven hundred and four people on board and everybody survived. So that was the exciting part of our life. Had a few free feeds on that the [to] talk when I came back. [Chuckles]

That’s incredible!

Yeah. And then 1960 Val broke her arm, and then she broke her hip; then she got Alzheimers, and now she’s in the Glengarry Rest Home. I can’t speak highly enough about them and the care that they give her. And now I live here by myself. We grew up in Wairoa together; we used to go to dances together, and we got married in 1957 I think it was, yes. Yeah.

What were your hobbies?

Well, swimming was one; lifesaving – I’ve got silver and bronze and gold medal[s] for lifesaving, and I used to examine the kids at the College for lifesaving in the baths; that was one thing I did. [There] was also athletics – running and rowing. Rowed in the New Zealand championships one year, but just as a crew member; never any good against those guns, but anyway, it was an experience.

And we had a place in Mahia, and I did a terrible … lot of fishing; I’ve had three or four boats and I’ve caught lots of fish in Mahia, and met some good mates in Mahia … Ken Johanssen – he’s dead now. We used to fish together a lot at Mahia. Yeah; anyway, as our family got bigger and bigger we sold the place to our sister-in-law, and now they’re living out there.

What about the running of Wairoa? [Did] you get involved with Council?

No, no, no, never got … In 1961 I joined the Wairoa Power Board as the faultman/electrician, and in 1986 [1996] I think, I retired from there. I did thirty-six years there, and I started at the bottom and I finished at the top.

[Chuckles] You couldn’t ask for better.

No. Yeah, and we had some big storms here. I was involved with the … what was the name of the big one that took the bridge?

Cyclone Bola?

Yeah, Cyclone Bola; yeah, was involved with that. And we always seemed to have a lot more storms around the Wairoa area than we do now, anyway. Some of them would last three days; we’d be out working all hours of the day and night to try and get the power back to the people. Yeah. But it was enjoyable; that’s why I was there for thirty-odd years. Mmm.

That’s a long record.

Yeah. Unfortunately while I was there we had a couple of our staff electrocuted. It was a sad time, but we got on with it and carried on. Yeah.

So did you have anything to do with the power station at Tuai?

No, we were a separate identity all told. Well, like we were a local body, and that was the government, yeah. We used to buy the power from Tuai though, and we’d maintain the lines that brought the power into … oh, no we didn’t maintain those; the main hydro[electricity] used to come into Wairoa to a substation, and then we’d pick up the power from there and distribute it all round the area.

In those days – in our courting days – there used to be dances on Saturday nights, and pictures on every night of the week, and two theatres on the weekend; but certainly haven’t got that now. And there used to be two or three dentists in the town and now there’s no dentists in the town.

Not a one?

No. No. And the population I think, was about eight thousand-odd in Wairoa in the 1950s. There was menswear shops and ladies’ shops, but now there’s nothing, you’ve got to go out of town to buy. But I think our population in Wairoa now is … ooh, maybe about four thousand eight hundred or something like that. Yeah, but I love living here and I would never shift. Mmm.

So what are your rates like?

Expensive. [Chuckle] My rates here are about $3,500 a year. But the Council is looking at trying to do something about the rates, but that’s all political, so I don’t get involved in that.

The only way to get them down would be to have a bigger population, wouldn’t it?

Oh, they’re trying to get a bigger population, yeah. Oh no, Wairoa’s good – we seem to have some undesirables that cause a few problems here and there, but I don’t ever see that … I hardly ever see that at all. There’s only … what is it? Black Power and the Mongies, [Mongrel Mob] they seem to fight but I never see it. Yeah. Oh, I enjoy living in Wairoa, the climate’s good and I’ve got some good mates here; and there’s some good people live in Wairoa.

Any more about your children? They’ve all left the nest, but …

They’re all gone; two girls – the oldest one and then the youngest one – they’re both girls and they’re both teachers. One teaches in Tamatea in Napier and the other teaches at Napier Boys’ High, and they’re good. And my two boys – one boy lives here in Wairoa with his own building business, and the other one is married and lives in Sweden. He served his time at Wairoa Power when I was the boss there. He packed his bag and took off, and met this Swedish girl over in India, I think, and then they got together and married and they’ve got children of their own in Sweden; live in a place called Malmo which is a city [of] about six hundred thousand, I think. But they come occasionally, every two or three years, but this time it’s been cancelled because of the virus. Yeah.

But all my kids have all been overseas, the whole four of them; they’ve all travelled, they’ve all been overseas, but they’ve come back to New Zealand, yeah – except the one who stayed over there. My grandfather came to New Zealand from Sweden in 1894, and he came with five shillings in his pocket. He was a tanner … a leather man; but he made a fortune, gambled it and lost it, all before he died, 1936. [Chuckles]

He sounds a character …

Yeah … oh, gambler, eh? Yeah. But anyway … my grandmother, she was Scotch [Scottish] descent, from Christchurch; he married her and they had six children. And she died in 1914 I think – there was a flu epidemic or something about that time.

That’s right, [speaking together] after the first world war.

And she died then. And he just toured the world; he put his daughters … he had four daughters … I think he put them into convents and the boys, they went into the Catholic schools … Boys’ Colleges … and that’s where they grew up. But they all made good.

My brother went to school at Wairoa College … Wairoa District High School in those days; he left there and then he joined the Air Force. He was in the Air Force for eight years, and he went to Cyprus in the Commonwealth occupation of Cyprus and Egypt; and yeah, he was there. Then he came back, and he left the Air Force one day and two days later he was walking the beat in Palmerston [North] as a policeman. He was in the Police Force for about … oh, ‘til he retired anyway, and well in the [his] fifties. In that time he collected a BEM … British Empire Medal … from the Queen for gallantry; he arrested some bank robber at Waihi or something one time. And he also had … one of the Police College units was named after him; he was the only serving police officer who had a College group named after him. But he died last year. Yeah – he was younger than me. I miss him too, yeah.

But when we were boys, and when we lived in Morere we could swim, and … gosh, we used to love swimming. We used to love it out there; hunt in the bush, and shoot deer, and fish for eels, and … yeah. And help Mum with the shop.

Did you go to the caves on the Moumoukai?

No, not at Moumoukai, but the Mangaone.

Did you go in those caves?

Yes. We used to often go up to those caves in Mangaone; yeah, we used to often go up there, yeah. While we were at Morere of course, the war years were on; war started ‘39, finished ‘45. Quite a few of the younger people from round the area went to the war. When they came back they went back to their farms and things, and it was great to have everybody back again, yeah. One of the Joblins was killed in the war … Fred Joblin’s son; he was killed in the war. He is Betty Benson’s brother. Yeah. But I knew of Fred Joblin… oh, I was a little fellow running around and he was the big noise around the Morere area then.

My father worked for him.

Oh, did he? Yeah, forget the name of their farm now; I think it’s sold now. Betty had it running for a while, and then her son-in-law I think, he took over as supervisor of it, but I think it’s been sold since. Then they had another place down in Nuhaka too … they had another farm, a sort of a fattening farm, and Fred Joblin lived down there once he came off the top farm.

One of his sons was Norman?

Yeah, Norman and Jack, I think.

Norman went to Waipukurau.

Oh, did he? Well it must have been Jack that got killed at the war. I think he was in the Air Force.

I think you’re right there. So have you ever been up the top of the Moumoukai?

No. I never ever went to the top of the Moumoukai. I think part of that was on Shaw’s land, and part of it might’ve been on Joblin’s land, I think.

‘Cause that’s Rakaipaaka, the iwi – it’s their mountain.

Yeah. I can remember when we were kids at Morere, the Mounted Rifles; they used to come on horseback from Tolaga Bay, and the one from Hawke’s Bay’d come up, and they’d meet on Moumoukai and they’d have war exercises up there. [Chuckle] I can remember that as a kid. Yeah. They were good old days; they were good days at Morere, yeah – hard, but they were good.

And so when your children were going to school here, were you on any school committees?

Yes, all my four children went to St Joseph’s Catholic School, and I was on the Board of Trustees, and I was on the Parish Council, and we were involved. I think I was on the Parish Council when the Catholic Church was a hundred and something years old; I was on the committee that … they had the celebrations and all that there. And it’s still here. But all the churches round Wairoa now, they don’t seem to have the numbers that were [there] when we were kids going to church, and our kids were going to school and that, there’s not the congregation at the churches now [that] there used to be.

In the old days the ladies used to have to wear a hat to church, didn’t they?

Yeah … yes, that’s right, they did too. Yeah, I can remember that. Mmm.

Matching shoes and handbag and gloves …

Yeah. And then I married Val Osler; Oslers were the bakers in Wairoa at the time, quite a big business. And I used to help with the deliveries of the bread [dog barking] and help in the bakehouse in all those years; but of course it’s all gone now – well no, it’s still in the family; but one of my nephews owns the building and the other one owns the business.

Who owns those photographs that they keep on the screen in the shop?

Well Stephen White, he runs the business now and he’s put all that stuff in, yeah, and he still runs it. And it’s New Zealand renowned for Osler’s pies. [Chuckle]

It’s the place to go to, isn’t it?

Yeah.

You didn’t have anything to do with getting the lighthouse from Portland Island to where it is now?

No. No. My neighbour, Bob Short, was the Mayor, and he got the lighthouse there. And as a matter of fact, his son, Bill Short, is my brother-in-law; he married my wife’s sister, so we’ve got quite a big connection with that [them] too. He’s [a] good bloke.

Has it made any difference to Wairoa now that they’ve got the rocket site out at Mahia?

Well it’s caused a lot of interest, but I don’t know whether it’s financially better for Wairoa or not. But it certainly drags the crowds when the rocket’s going off, and there’s always a lot of talk and interest about it. It’s amazing really, that it’s shot off from Mahia and they’re building it at Mahia. But I haven’t seen it going off at all yet. But people come from all over the place to watch it, yeah.

So you haven’t bought a ticket to be the first one up?

I doubt it. [Chuckle] I don’t think I will be, either.

But the Sturms … I knew Humphrey, and Willa, and Buster, and Darren and all those kids from Reuben Sturm’s …

From the garage, yeah.

Yeah. My father worked for the Wairoa Power Board too, from 1924 [when] he came to Wairoa; and he left Wairoa Power in 1945. He worked for Sturm’s garage for about twelve months before he died, yeah – he was working there when he died, actually.

Who was his boss then?

Reuben was the boss.

Reuben and my father were first cousins.

Oh, were they? Yeah. [Of] course though, when Reuben left I think Ray took over. I think he died last year, Ray.

[Break]

Right, we’re talking about picture theatres.

Yeah, there used to be a picture theatre at Nuhaka, and some friends of ours, or one of our neighbours, used to take me and my brother [my brother and I] down for the pictures at Nuhaka. It was a two-storeyed building, and all the pakehas used to be upstairs, and the locals and all the Maori people used to be downstairs. And they used to sit on forms, and the poor old proprietor of the theatre, he’d be at his wit’s end – they’d drop a bottle at one end of the seat, and they’d drop it all the way along; he’d run along to that end to catch ‘em, but it would be that end, you see. They were dropping them … oh, yeah. I can remember him. Half-time you used to get an ice-cream.

And I can remember being at the pictures one time, [the] local constable was there, and we were all sitting up in the gallery at the picture hall, and ‘Frankenstein’ was on. Well, I’m sitting there watching Frankenstein, and Frankenstein was just in the throes of throttling somebody and this Policeman dropped his helmet over my head. Got such a fright I thought I was dead. [Chuckles] Yeah – I was sitting there watching it, and yeah, I was only about twelve, I suppose, and he dropped his blimmin’ helmet over my head – I got a hell of a fright! [Chuckle] Yeah.

But there used to be another big hall below that, and the Green and Gold Ball used to be held once a year out at Mahia, and it was a big do. Buses used to run out from Wairoa … but those buildings are all gone now, although there is a big hall at Nuhaka; it was built about … oh, ‘bout the fifties somewhere. Yeah, the Mormons built … I think it was financed and organised from Hawaii. But that’s the main hall at Nuhaka now. Oh, pretty lively place; there used to be a railway station there, and a wharf at Waikokopu. And of course the flood came in … what was that flood? In about 1938 … came down through the camp there at Paritu Loop at … what was the name of it? Oh, can’t remember now.

Was that when they were working on the railway line?

Yeah, on the railway line, yeah.

And those guys lost their lives?

Yeah; well my uncle was in it actually, and he survived by getting on top of his hut. He survived it, he was working there. Yeah. What the hell did they call that flood? Had a name … [Kopuawhara] And we were at Morere at that particular time that flood came, and we had a river just below us, and it came up; went right through our house, I can remember that.

That would be the ..?

Tuna Nui. It was just … might’ve been the Rakaipaaka which you’ve got further down. No, it was Tuna Nui, I think, yeah. The Nuhaka it might’ve been, yeah – but anyway, it’s the same river, anyway.

And Wairoa town, how many times has it lost its bridge?

Well in my time, only once. And it was replaced where it is now. That’s with Bola, in my time; but before my time I think it lost the bridge a couple of times. But they weren’t [it wasn’t] in the position that it’s in now, it was further upstream.

A pity you didn’t come before when my mate was alive, old Timmy Gray, he’s dead now; been dead for a couple of years. He’d have been a great orator for that. He used to tell stories about … he was there in the earthquake; and his first day at school; and he was there when the bridge went, and all that … ‘cause I think the bridge might’ve gone in the earthquake. Yeah, lost it a couple of times, didn’t they? No, before my time.

The Mohaka viaduct, what difference did that make?

No … before my time. And of course living at Morere, we never had much to do with that end ‘cause you know, transport and things like [?] cars in those days – there was a bus if you wanted to go to Napier, but hardly ever went to Napier. Hardly ever went to Gisborne; used to take an hour to get from Morere to Gisborne in those days by car, and now it only takes an hour from Wairoa to Gisborne.

I had an aunt that had a Baby Austin, [Austin 7] I think it was, and she had to reverse up the Morere hill; and her children remember jumping out and trying to find the biggest boulders they could to stick under the tyres.

Yeah, ‘cause the Morere hill was quite famous on the S-bend – they used to call it the S-bend. The transport from Gisborne, I don’t know where – they used to bring goods and that down to Morere, and into Wairoa I suppose, and the S-bend was the famous place where those blokes used to jump off the bank and pick up the mail bags. That’s where that fellow Kirk … I think he was doing that too. They’ve straightened it out of course, now – no trouble getting up there now.

But I can remember [as] a kid, in Gisborne when they were building the tunnels they used to get the metal, I think from Nuhaka, to cart to the tunnels up around Kopuawhara – Kopuawhara Flood, that was the name of that flood – up Kopuawhara and up in [???] and all that, I can remember trucks, and the drivers – it’d be four o’clock in the morning; they’d be carting metal all day. And a lot of those blokes went to the war. You know, they were young blokes driving the trucks, they went to the war. And a lot of them came back too, I can remember them coming back. Busy time at Morere in those years. I think it still is but I never go out there now.

So who actually owns the Morere complex now, where the pools are?

The pools is [are] owned by the government but it’s leased out, you know. They’ve got proprietors in there; they run it as a business. When we were kids there it was run by the government – what did they used to call themselves in those days? Not Lands & Survey … no, I can’t remember, but it was run by the government right up ‘til not many years ago when they decided to put it out to private enterprise. Used to cost threepence a swim, [quiet chuckle] but half the time we didn’t pay, of course; we were locals; [chuckle] just went for a swim, yeah.

And do you believe in its health properties … the sulphur?

Oh, I didn’t have anything to do with that. Well it was renowned … people used to come and board at our place and take the baths for arthritis and things like that, so there must be something about it. Yeah, they were good old days. I can remember some of the younger people in Wairoa there, and once they used to bike out to Morere on their bikes, just to stay a few days and take the baths and the bush, and play around there. I can remember that, ‘cause when I came to the Wairoa District High School those jokers were at the school as well; I knew them before they got to the high school. Well it was the Wairoa District High School in those days, I don’t know what year they changed it to the college.

So was it co-ed?

Yeah. I can’t remember how many there was [were] there … hundred and something kids, I suppose.

What was your favourite subject?

Rugby. [Chuckle]

You went to school to eat your lunch? [Chuckle]

Went to school to eat my lunch, yeah. You know, we had maths and spelling and English and all that, but I was in what they called the ‘G’ class which was General; we used to be out doing the gardens and the lawns and things like that. Then there was the ‘A’ class which was the ones that went on to be lawyers and doctors and all that sort of thing. I never got there, but I did all right.

But they didn’t have to mow the lawns?

No. And they didn’t play rugby either. [Chuckle] We used to go to Gisborne to play against Gisborne High School, and we used to go to Napier a couple of times. And when I was in the athletics we used to travel by bus to those other centres for competitions; not that we were ever much good but still, we attended. [Chuckle]

I used to enjoy rowing, it was one of my favourite sports. Now the rowing sheds … they don’t even use the river for rowing now. Gets up my wick because everything’s there, the eights and the fours and single sculls, but nobody ever uses them. And yet when I was a young fellow, every young fellow in Wairoa used to row. I think it was 1954 or ‘55 they had the New Zealand Championships held in Wairoa, and it was about three or four days of rowing competition from all the best rowers all over New Zealand. I was involved in the running of the Maadi Cup, which is the College schools Rowing of the Year, and we held that in Wairoa one year. The Maadi Cup; and it’s all over New Zealand now – Auckland and Christchurch – everywhere; all the Colleges row for the Maadi Cup. We held that here one year too. Can’t remember what year it was, I know I was an umpire so [I] must’ve had my own boat and that, you know. Must’ve been in the sixties some time … sixties or seventies it might’ve even been. Yeah, it might’ve been in the seventies.

How deep is the Wairoa River?

Oh, I don’t know how deep it is … used to be deep in those days; but sometimes now if there’s a flood, logs’ll come down the river and they’ll get stuck in the bottom, and the Catchment Board has to shift them; things like that, yeah. But oh, rowing used to be strong here. We used to have the LVA … Gisborne’d come and Hawke’s Bay’d come up. And [of] course Wairoa’s got a mile straight in the river, and it was one of the best rivers to run [row] on. Gisborne haven’t got that; oh, the Clive River, [Hastings] but I don’t think it’s as good as the Wairoa River to row on.

Did you have regattas?

Oh yeah, we had regattas every year. The Wairoa Rowing Club – we’d have three or four competitions a year with regattas. Different businessmen around town’d provide cups and things, you know … medals and things, yeah. [In] fact a couple of my cousins – they’re both gone now, they’re older than me – they were New Zealand Pair rowing champion[s] for years, and they were from Christchurch. They were my first cousins. And I think their family’s still involved with the rowing, yeah. It’s a shame, that river … the yachting’s still quite strong here, they’ve got their own clubhouse and everything, but they don’t come up this end of the river, they’re down at the far end. It’s a shame really, river’s going to waste. Oh, Ski Club – I think they’re still keen, but a lot of the people come from Gisborne for that because, once again, for the river … good long straights, yeah. But on the other hand the river can be an enemy to us as well, in floods.

With the Wairoa River, it’s getting over the bar, isn’t it?

Yeah. In the old days … I can never remember that, that was before my time when the boats used to come over the bar, bring people in and stuff for the town, and your goods. I can remember a couple of times though, seeing scows at AFFCO [Auckland Farmers Freezing Company] – or Swifts in those days – tied up there taking goods out from AFFCO.

Meat?

Yeah, but like, that’s every hazy; that didn’t happen much at all that I can remember.

Are you involved with the museum?

Yep. I was on the museum when they formed the museum. I was on it for about … how long was I on it? ‘Bout sixteen years I suppose, but I got off. The museum used to be down where the library is now; well I was involved when we shifted down to where it is now. It was the ANZ Bank, and I was heavily involved in the rebuilding and the reorganisation of that. Yeah; I was the clerk of works on the site of the museum, on the committee, you know. Yeah, I was heavily involved in that, but … no, I’ve done my dash, eh? It’s all changed down there again now, though.

Should be very proud of yourselves for that museum.

Yeah – it’s a lovely museum, eh?

Very well worth a visit.

Yeah. Yeah, we shifted all the gear … was at the museum, and then we shifted it all down there; big job – shifted it all in, and trying [to] get it up and running. But we did it, but they were interesting days … they were interesting days. There’s not many on the committee now that was here when I was here – in fact I don’t think there is anybody. All changed now.

And look at it. Is it a part-time curator that [who] comes from Gisborne?

Yeah, Mike Speeding. We had a curator for quite a while – Jim … I forget his other name – he was there for quite a while and then he retired, and then we got a curator from Gisborne, and he brought the place on good. Yeah, but I think he’s sort of backing out a bit now too. ‘Cause we had Nigel Howe, who’s great in the museum; he was a curator, and runs the Maori heritage and all that sort of stuff. I think he’s still there now. And we had Jill Grooby who was on the counter – she was marvellous; she just retired. Yeah, so I don’t know what they’re up to now, or who’s there or what’s there. Yeah, I was heavily involved from when we brought it from the ANZ Bank, and when we were bringing the counters down there was [were] bits and pieces around – well, we turned it into what it is now. [Chuckle] We had a few headaches and things, but we got there in the finish. Some women’re still involved I think, with the Friends of the Museum and that. Yeah. No, it was good.

Graham, I thank you very much for this interview …

Oh, thank you.

… pleased that you were able to tell us quite a bit about Wairoa that will help future generations understand what it was like living here in your time. We wish you all the best. Thank you.